Twitter Lists – Separating Ego and “Influence” From Genuine Utility

by vergenewmedia on November 8, 2009

iStock_000001117637SmallWith Twitter’s recent roll-out of Lists functionality, there’s been a lot of division over their utility, measure of influence, and whether they simply serve as self-referential ego strokes for the technorati establishment.  OK, I admit I was a bit giddy to discover how many lists I was on, and YES, I made that little “I’m Listed!” image link there on the right sidebar. Wordpress Bible author Aaron Brazell confirmed to me that the sidebar link does in fact qualify as social media douchebaggery, but hey I’m embracing it.. owning those bona fides if you will. :) Regardless, lists do give users the ability to take the firehose of their Twitter data and break it down into manageable streams.

I’m still figuring out how I’m going to use them and I’d love your advice here. In the comments below, please leave smart ideas on how people are using lists, beyond the usual “social media ninja”, “thought leader” kind of stuff.  I’m also interested in hearing your thoughts about whether you make your lists public and how Twitter might make this functionality better.

Publishing those lists is what seems dividing users. So when the functionality appeared in my stream, I shared the news and was eager to jump in. Right off the bat, one of my dearest Twitter friends, Jon Swanson, made me stop and think.

@newmediajim wait. what if we don’t WANT to be managed? -
@jnswanson

By then, interweb titans Chris Brogan and Robert Scoble were well into a debate about the misgivings and merits surrounding lists.  That conversation has been propogated and amplified on the web, and at the end of this post, I’ll provide links to some other interesting viewpoints. I did an informal poll on Twitter asking.

TWITTER LISTS – social media d-bag ego stroke?, spam opportunity?, measure of influence?, useful tool? all of the above?

Here is a sampling of the responses I received.

jillinski @newmediajim Also, ppl are hard to fit into just 1 list. So I’ve decided to bail on the whole concept. Does this make me a Twitter Luddite?

You2Gov @newmediajim Lists: some will abuse, most will make useful tool. Ego is involved, but so is altruism, transparency and flat communications.

Scobleizer @newmediajim you are on my tech news people list so you KNOW my answer is “all of the above!” :-) Seriously, lists are crack.T

thomasknoll @newmediajim lists are for listening

SGnow @newmediajim Twitter lists… Something to use to organize and discover. Not overthink.

While lists probably aren’t something we should over think, they do merit discussion.. to a point.  I think we all know, that there will be “rock star” or “must follow” lists, which will serve little more than as self-perpetuating ego strokes.  For instance, I’m a member of two VERY elite Twitter lists.  These lists reside behind a virtual velvet rope of the ultra hip lounge called the internet.  They are:

Clearly, I’ve managed my online reputation well. ;)

How Others Perceive You

If you do show up on lists, it is a unique opportunity to see how others perceive you.  Leah Jones compares Twitter lists to Johari Windows.  In her post, she describes how she was surprised a bit at peoples’ perceptions of her.  There’s an interesting web tool out there by MustExist that allows you to see a tag cloud of words that people use to describe you (or your brand) in lists.  To me, this is a much more important data set than how many lists you’re on or how many followers you have.

Measure of Influence

In his post “Using Twitter Lists to Judge Influence”, The Bivings Group’s Todd Zeigler posits that being listed is a far better metric of “influence” than simply being followed.  This post has been getting a lot of traction, re-tweets, and references, but I’m not sure I agree with it entirely.

I think Twitter Lists will end up helping separate the men from the boys when it comes to influence.  In addition to seeing a Twitter users follower count, we can now see the number of other Twitter users who have added them to lists – Todd Zeigler

Here’s why I’m a bit skeptical.  As of this writing, I’m on some 600 lists.  But if you take a look, you’ll see that the vast majority of them are followed by ZERO, bupkus, nil, naught, nuthin!  Others might have a handful of follows and are likely people that already follow me on Twitter.  Seems a bit redundant to me, so I’m not sure how accurate a measure of influence lists really are.

Real Utility

During the coverage of the horrifyingly tragic shootings at Fort Hood, journalism demonstrated the curation value of lists. The New York Times, The Huffington Post and The Today Show all created lists of a variety of sources from the center of the crisis.  Sadly, a violent shooting rampage happened just the next day in Orlando, Florida.  Again, lists were created by smart, Twitter savvy journalists like Etan Horowitz.

I think how people end up using lists privately,  might demonstrate their real utility.  From filtering out noise to geographic, and categorical organization,  these bread and butter applications will be the mainstay, yet less blogged about practices.   Again, let me know in the comment some smart ways, either publicly or privately, you plan on using lists.

Further Reading

Why Twitter Lists Change Everything

Are Lists Good for Social Media

Twitter Lists – Proof That Social Media Misunderstands Itself

Twitter Strokes Egos With a New A-List Popularity Contest

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  • nwjerseyliz
    I've written a bit on Lists, both for my blog & Mashable, and definitely have formed an opinion about them. First, I ran an informal TwitPoll on whether users would rather be placed on a List or be Followed (not both) or didn't care. Only 17% of people opted for Lists which, to me, says that most people care less about perceived prestige & more about conversation.

    Second, like Followers, the user has absolutely no way of knowing how many people who follow you or a List you're on actually ever see or read the Tweets you publish. I have 20 Lists, follow another 20 and I only regularly check 3 or 4 of them. It doesn't mean I don't occasionally peek in on the others but it's not on a daily basis. So, taking the number of Lists you're on as a sign of your "sphere of influence" is laughable, I think.

    We're in the early adopter phase, where the tech & social media are trying things out. What happens when a Jonas Brothers superfan is on 2500 Lists? Or spammers/marketers realize that while they can only follow 2,000 Twitterers with their Following List, using Lists they can follow 10,000? Will being "Listed" have the same allure?

    The only thing certain about Twitter is that in 3 months, it won't resemble what it looks like today. Lists should be fun & functional and to attach your self-worth or self-esteem to your placement on any List is not only foolish but shallow because, hey, it's as easy to be taken off a List as put on a List. I put together Lists that I later completely deleted because I had new ones I wanted to create. Lists are works in progress, not written in stone.
  • newmediajim
    In fact, some are meant to specifically be temporary. I'm going to try and put one together of all the White House Press Corps folk on the upcoming Asia trip. I'll probably delete it after we get back.
  • The potential uses of lists is unlimited. We all have ideas about how to use something and part of the value in anything is in what we can find to do with it.

    Ken has an idea for how to use lists that I see some value in. His idea? Putting people or companies he may not wish to watch closely, yet still wants to be able to check out without having to look them up or remember their user name, into a list and unfollowing them thereby keeping the noise in his twitter stream to a minimum. To each his own.

    As for where our value is, I would say I'm still skeptical as to how important lists are. Look, if I'm honest I will tell you I put virtually all the people I follow on a list. I made categories that made sense to me. general categories. I'm not terribly creative so they are general. I went through my list methodically and added everybody somewhere. That's for me. It's not for other people. it's for me and me alone. I don't honestly care what other people think about where I put them because how I remember a person is what keeps them at the forefront of my brain. Aren't the lists for us?

    I hear constantly how where you have been placed determines your value. I call bullshit. (sorry, but I do) Half the people I know who I also KNOW truly care about me, haven't placed me on a list. Of those who did put me on a list, my guess is they put me on a list that made sense to them. Does that raise my value to them? Probably not.

    Lists suck if everyone is going around comparing how many they are on with others. Why do we have to look outward for validation? It's not a lot different than how many followers one has. The real questions we should all be asking is how well do those who put us on a list, or for that matter those who follow us in general, know us? How well do we know them? Saying you're connected to 'Jim Long' might boost a persons ego, but why? We're all connected anyway.

    Why is the biggest topic of discussion focused on one's influence and how to tell if you have it? It's a constant game of oneupmanship. We should already know we are relevant.
  • I think you're hitting it about right on all fronts, Jim. There are those that have scooped Lists up and turned them into a popularity contest. *yawns* Lists do have a useful front, though. Depending on the number of people you follow, Lists are time consuming & at times tedious to put together, but I do feel they have several positive and good functions.

    I've made, deleted and revised Lists at least twice now. I'm not done, I'll probably change them from time to time as they fit a purpose or need in my life. No one is purposely not included, I may just not have seen them online when I've been working on Lists. Since I don't auto-follow, I don't auto-List.

    My most important List IS the one of people I all ready follow. As well, Lists can help with my being open to the new people that enter my life. You can add people to your Lists before you follow them. I've recently started a new list, reaching out to Tweeps in a four state region of which I'll be traveling so I can make RL connections with people I've come to know & care about online.

    I have public lists and private lists. I think businesses can make good use of lists, as can you. Family, local friends, work colleagues. Drinking buddies. Media people. You can be as fun and creative or as to the point and factual as you want to be. My lists are a referral point for me. If Twitter makes it so I can send a message to "just those on a specific list" then they will become truly useful for myself as well as many others.

    As far as the ego contests. Well, boys will be boys. It's either by the size of their toys, gimmick of their gadgets or whatever makes their lists groove. ;-)

    btw ... I love the look of your blog these days. Especially love the layout & look of how you wrote this post up. Awesome, that's way I say! *hugs*
  • newmediajim
    "If Twitter makes it so I can send a message to "just those on a specific list" then they will become truly useful for myself as well as many others."

    THAT would be huge!
  • Your social media reputation is built not on what you do or what you say, but on how many people SEE what you do HEAR what you say. As such, it doesn't matter if no one ever follows the lists you're on, because merely seeing that you're on so many lists means other people think you're relevant, so newbies MUST think you're relevant too, right? ;)

    Slightly less cynically, it actually doesn't matter if anyone follows the lists you're listed on. That's a measure of the influence of the people who MADE the lists, not the people who are on them. I might think all 600 of the lists you're on are crap, but I can still choose to follow you personally.

    True relevance is not a numbers game.
  • newmediajim
    "it actually doesn't matter if anyone follows the lists you're listed on. That's a measure of the influence of the people who MADE the lists, not the people who are on them"

    yup, that's the problem I had with Todd Zeigler's post.
  • Jim: I'm working on a method for determining "diamonds in the rough" (people on more lists than you expect) that I'll publish once the lists thing settles down a bit).
  • newmediajim
    I'm looking forward to seeing that Mark!
  • Any metric, especially public ones, can feed our egos. Me, I've got two lists right now and I made them both with no intention of getting others to follow them.

    Since I do a lot of WordPress work I made one for other WP folks in my network. Makes it easier for me to reach out to them on a professional basis.

    Since I'm all about connecting, the other list I made is for people on Twitter that I've met in person. Not particularly useful to anyone. But kind of interesting to me just the same.
  • newmediajim
    I like the idea of the "people i've met in person" list :) it's the kind of list i'd be inspired to see grow. Again, personal uses very interesting
  • Hey fellow Team Hot Salad Dressing member! Yeah we be cool!

    Heh, yep, there's definitely ego involved, not just being on lists but creating them, too, in that "known by the company you keep" way.

    I have a few lists, including a people I've met list and a people I knew before Twitter list, and some others I've chosen to share. But the funny thing is, the list I made of people I really want to follow closely I've kept private, so the people I added don't even know they're on it. I'm sure I'll change the way I use them as time goes on.
  • newmediajim
    you knew people before Twitter? ;)
  • What I'm really hoping for is that the new Twitter lists get merged somehow with the existing TweetDeck group functionality so that I can assign someone to a list and their tweets automatically appear in the proper TweetDeck column. For me, this would make Twitter lists truly useful and not just a influence "vote" for someone else.
  • newmediajim
    Kevin, now that would be a smart evolution of lists. But couldn't you just create a column in Tweet Deck now as sort of a "list"?
  • Yes, in TweetDeck you use "groups" to organize who you follow and these groups can be displayed as individual columns. If TweetDeck groups incorporated Twitter lists an organizing step could be skipped and it would be much easier to get a new Tweep one is following to appear in the correct column.

    Ken
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